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tv   Meet the Press  NBC  April 10, 2016 8:00am-9:01am PDT

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this sunday, political "the hunger games" in the gop. ted cruz sweeps the delegates in colorado. >> i think we will go in with an overwhelming advantage. >> it looks more and more like we're headed to an open convention that could deny trump the nomination. the man trump just hired to save his campaign joins me. plus, look who got nasty this week. >> he hasn't done his homework. >> i don't believe that she is qualified -- >> they called a truce, but is the damage done? joining me this morning, bernie sanders and new york city mayor bill de blasio, a key clinton supporter. also, ryan's hope. many republicans want paul ryan to be their nominee. he says no. so what's this about?
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>> so let's have a battle of ideas. let's have a contest of whose ideas are better. >> if ryan doesn't want the nomination, why does this video look like a campaign ad to so many people? finally, kasich does the deli, bernie eats pizza, the subway, new york, new york. if you can pander there, you can pander anywhere. and joining me for insight and analysis this sunday morning are matt bai of yahoo news, msnbc's joy-ann reid, molly and rich lowry of the national review. welcome to sunday, it's "meet the press." from nbc news in washington, this is "meet the press" with chuck todd. good sunday morning. the bernie sanders winning streak keeps on keeping on. sanders won the wyoming caucuses yesterday. it's his seventh win in the last eight contests. how byzantine is the process?
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hillary clinton wound up with more delegates than sanders. we'll get to the democratic race and worrys that this week's nasty turn will hold help republicans in november. mayor bill de blasio of new york, hillary clinton supporter will join me. we begin with the changing landscape. from the start donald trump has played it big, made big speeches, draw big crowds and win big in big primaries. and then let the details take care of themselves. but the details aren't taking care of themselves. ted cruz is taking care of them. and he's piling up delegates in this byzantine process. this weekend in colorado cruz won all 34 of colorado's available unbound delegates. he also had a big day gathering delegates in iowa, south carolina and virginia. it's just the latest development in this tortoise and hare race in which cruz is playing the tortoise slowly gaining delegate by delegate on a trump campaign that's been sleeping on the job. >> when it comes to the grass roots, donlald has a very hard time competing.
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>> the stop trump movement is turning to a new kind of ground game, working to out organize trump in the state by state battle for delegates. so far it's working. trump was shut out at this weekend's colorado convention. >> ted cruz. >> ted cruz. >> ted cruz. >> and just one of 25 delegates selected last sunday in north dakota said he plans to back trump. trump's colorado state delegate director started in his job on wednesday after the previous director was fired. >> it's been like drinking from a fire hose. >> it's a very arcane system. they have land mines all over the place, and i think it's -- it is unfair -- >> he has little margin for error. trump must win 61% of remaining delegates to clench the delegate majority he needs to avoid a contested convention. supporters dismiss questions about his organization's efforts in colorado. >> probably wouldn't carry the state anyway. you fight the battles you can win. >> and trump is depending on a big win in new york, where he's
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polling above 50%. >> it's great to be home. >> hoping to sweep the empire state's 95 delegates and completely shut out ted cruz. >> do you remember during the debate when he started lecturing me on new york values like we're no good? like we're no good. >> lukewarm feelings about cruz have some stop trump estabshment republicans dreaming of none of the above. >> liberals -- >> house speaker paul ryan fueled the speculation this week by releasing this campaign-style video. >> so let's have a battle of ideas. let's have a contest of whose ideas are better. >> while trump dismisses any talk of campaign power struggles in public. >> i had not heard anything about the inner fightings of the campaign. >> in private trump's team is clearly worried. expanding the role of new hire paul manafort. a one-time republican powerhouse trump brought in to be his convention manager. and joining me now is donald trump's new convention manager paul manafort, a one-time delegate wrangler for harold
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ford and bob dole brought in to stop this delegate bleeding. welcome back to "meet the press." >> thank you. >> let me start with what a cruz official claimed to me this weekend, that there are 144 different delegate selection events yesterday in 11 states. and they were stunned that essentially outside of michigan the trump campaign was nowhere. is that a fair assessment? >> not at all. first of all, alabama, they caucused this weekend. and we've got all the committee spots, convention committee spots have been assigned in michigan as you correctly said where they made a real effort they failed. in fact, we wiped him out. he's got no committee appointments out of michigan. and in nevada preview of coming attractions, clarke county went overwhelmingly for donald trump and they have the majority of the delegates to the state convention leader in this process. and you're going to see ted cruz get skunked in nevada. >> but you acknowledge that
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they've been out gunning the trump campaign on these weekend events? >> acknowledge we weren't playing in colorado when they did. i acknowledge that they've taken an approach to some of the county conventions where they can scorch policy and don't care about the party. if they don't get what they want, they blow it up. that's not going to work. in fact, it's all secondary games. because when you're talking about delegates, you have to distinguish between actual delegates or trojan delegates which are people committed to support someone on the first ballot regardless of who they're for. >> you've been very outspoken saying, look, what cruz is doing is going to be moot because you guys are going to win this in the first ballot. in fact, you claim you will clinch this nomination by mid may. they you won't need california to put you over the top. >> no, i didn't say we'd clinch it. i said we'd be the presumptive nominee. which means you would see the path -- >> okay. you won't be crossing the line. >> we've got to go through to june. we have to wait until the process is done, but i'm
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confident. we have several ways through june 7th to go over 1237. and, you know, not counted in that at all are any of these unbound delegates who are getting selected, many of whom i feel pretty good about. >> now, look, there's been some talk about what's going on inside the campaign. are you running this campaign now? is that the fairest way to look at it? >> donald trump is running this campaign and i'm working directly for donald trump. but i'm working with the whole team as well. and, you know, a lot of what's being talked about is much adieu about nothing. yes, there's a transition. it's a natural transition. trump was doing very well on a model that made sense. but now that the campaign has gotten to the end stages a more traditional campaign has to take place. and trump recognized that and is now reaching out not just with me but others you'll start to see coming in. >> donald trump has hired you because he says he needs an insider to help him with experience with this. some could argue it's been a long time since you've been a washington insider. you yourself have said that. do you know these delegates? the selection process may be the same from '96 or '76, do you
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know these people? >> you would be surprised who've been calling me over the last week and where they're from. you know, do i know the 25, 30-year-old delegates? no. do i know the people who push buttons in a lot of these states? yes. that's not even the point. there's a lot of residual support for donald trump out there that hasn't been tapped. whether it's more or somebody else it's the process. if you know how to use the process, the support is there. >> i want to talk about some of the methods you're going to use to try to cajole these delegates. let me play something your former business partd ner roger stone said, get you to react to it. >> we're going to have protests, demonstrations. we will disclose the hotels and the room numbers of those delegates who are directly involved in the steal. >> appropriate rhetoric? >> i'm not giving him my hotel room. >> okay. is that -- >> roger is not an official part of the campaign. >> did he bring you in? >> no. in fact not at all. i came in a totally different way. i've known trump for 30 years.
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when somebody started talking about the need to bring in additional people to deal with this process, friends not at all from the political realm even, he listened and then reached out. >> what is fair game to win a delegate? is threatening a fair game? >> it's not my style. it's not donald trump's style. but it has ted cruz's style. and that's going to wear thin very fast. >> you think he's threatening delegates? >> well, he's threatening -- you go to his county conventions and you see the gastapo tactics. >> that's a strong word. >> we're filing several protests because the reality is they are not playing by the rules. but frankly that's the side game. the only game i'm focusing on right now is getting delegates. and the games that have happened even this past weekend, you know, are not important to the long-term game of how do we get to 1237. >> but is he -- i guess what is fair game in getting a delegate? is paying for their convention costs? is it golf club memberships? what's fair and unfair in this?
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what's ethical and unethical? >> there's the law and ethics and i'm not going to get into what tactics to use. i happen to think the best way we're going to get delegates is have donald trump exposed to delegates, hear what he says. he's done very well so far by putting himself in position by communicating. i think the key for delegates coming up, especially the unbound delegates, is the electability question. and right now we're in a fight. and this fight is, you know, causes the negative score for all the candidates. but there's not one question in my mind, not one state you can look at that romney lost in 2012 that cruz can win. not one. but trump changes the whole map. as we get into those arguments, which is the end game of the end game, that persuasion starts to have an impact. >> you have some controversial clients in your past. some current, some in the past. has mr. trump asked you to stop working for certain clients, stop doing work in ukraine if it's against america's national security? >> well, the work i was doing in
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ukraine was to help ukraine get into europe. and we succeeded. but i'm not working for any clients right now other than mr. trump. >> are you going to make a promise in the future that if he's president you'll be careful what clients you take? >> i'm always careful what clients i take. >> all right. i will leave it there. paul manafort, new convention manager, thank you for coming on. >> thank you. >> let's bring in matt bai, molly ball of the atlantic, my colleague at msnbc joy-ann reid and rich lao owrlowry, editor o national review. welcome to you all. rich, let me start with you. you've heard what's going on. i think the trump campaign saw what was happening. donald trump saw what was happening to them in the states and they had to make this change. is it going to work? >> this is a campaign that was built on media interviews, on big rallies and on a twitter feed. and even now that they're retooling i doubt grassroots organizing will ever be in its dna the way it is for the cruz campaign. and there's still a lot of variables, obviously, if trump's short how far short, what's the
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margin with cruz, what do his general election numbers look like in july? but we may be getting to a place where it's slightly more likely that ted cruz will be the nominee than donald trump. because if it gets to a convention, that is very favorable terrain for cruz. >> but, molly, as paul has made it clear both with me and in previous interviews they're not going to get to a second ballot. to me that's acknowledgment they need to get to this on a first ballot. >> it may be. i don't think that's necessarily the sub text of what he's saying. i think they are doing everything in their control to also make the second ballot feasible for them if it should come to that. you know, you always want to say you're going to win this thing straight out and you're not going to need to get to that point. but when he was talking about the trojan delegates and trying to make sure that the delegates that are committed on the first ballot are committed all the way through, that's clearly also an effort they're making. so i think what the message that paul manafort is trying to send in that interview and a lot of other interviews is that things are under control, that they
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know what they're doing and that was very much not the case before. >> this weekend, i mean, that's what you look at this weekend and the cruz campaign has really pounded their chest. >> there's a couple questions, right. can trump get to 1237? and obviously that's going to be their first game. and we are talking about this and i think it looks less and less likely. but then paul manafort says something interesting. we are going to let trump be exposed to delegates. i think this gets to the heart of the issue. say he gets really close, the closer he gets to 1237, even if he doesn't get it, that's on him. he has to go out and convince a certain number of delegates that he's a worthwhile -- if he can't do that. shame on him and he doesn't deserve the nomination. >> unbound delegate -- >> but you know, joy, it's funny matt brings it up this way and paul said, who's going to win -- who's a better shot at winning over a room of 100? ted cruz or donald trump? >> well, i think it depends because in the previous proce processes they sent surrogates
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in. i think ted cruz then has a problem because he's not exactly a personable fellow. so if they're doing the persuasion one-on-one, i think you'd think trump would gain some advantage. >> you always hear trump is fun, right? he has this way about him. >> have you watched "the apprentice"? if he can't get a room of 100 -- >> go ahead and finish, joy. >> i think the thing is what we're seeing here and it's fascinating to watch politics reassert itself. while donald trump has had some of the air campaign, you've seen them just not playing in terms of the nuts and bolts of what you do to actually win a nomination. and ted cruz does not have that. he doesn't have the ability to be -- but he plays the game. >> i thought the eliminating answer i said so who's running this campaign and he said, well, donald trump's in charge. the most honest statement there is. yes, candidates are in charge of their own campaign, but in this case he is. >> i spoke to donald trump a few weeks ago and one of the things i asked him, you know, you haven't had anybody with
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presidential campaign experience really. don't you think you need some of those people, or is this just a completely new model of campaign where those people are irrelevant now? and he said, well, this has worked for me so far. so there's clearly been -- so now there's clearly been a realization on his part that it isn't working anymore or at the very least that there needs to be someone in the room who does know what they're doing. >> this question of cruz and persuasion at the convention, i think it's a mistake to think the convention's going to be like a luncheon at the capitol hill club where everyone's a senator and a lobbyists. these will be activists, they'll be conservative. they are ted cruz's kind of people. and at every single one of these meetings that campaign is making sure they're going to be ted cruz kind of people. >> you know who else they're like? they're probably paul ryan type of people too. that is a conversation -- i'm just throwing a grenade in. let it explode and we'll talk about it later in the show. but coming up, what if the republican establishment manages to deny both trump and cruz the nomination? would some conservatives simply stay home on election day? i'm going to ask a man who might
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know, radio talk show host and founder of "the blaze,". but next, bernie sanders joins me along with new york we were born 100 years ago into a new american century. born with a hunger to fly and a passion to build something better. and what an amazing time it's been, decade after decade of innovation, inspiration and wonder. so, we say thank you america for a century of trust, for the privilege of flying higher and higher, together. ♪ ♪ ♪ (laughing)
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there's nothing like making their day. except making sure their tomorrow is taken care of too. financial guidance while you're mastering life. from chase. so you can. while you're mastering life. hello prashant bhuyan. co-founder of the fintech services start-up. hello watson. your analysis of social media and conversations on various trading floors, helps us uncover insights. insights that help investors predict market closes, well before markets close. you know, your analysis has helped us improve our predictive accuracy by over 500%. 550.2, to be precise, but we can always do better. i like your attitude watson. it was this same old story in the democratic caucuses in wyoming yesterday. bernie sanders won the votes, but hillary clinton got the delegates. sanders won wyoming by 12 points, 5644. but that didn't help him in the
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delegate race. clinton took 11 delegates to sanders 7 when you threw the supers, the super designate gats. as you can see, clinton still holds a large delegate lead. it came after a week of unusually harsh sniping between sanders and clinton in anticipation of next week's make or make new york state caucuses. senator sanders joins me now from his home state, new york city. senator, welcome back, sir. >> great to be with you. >> let me start with what happened in wyoming. how frustrating is it to you that you won by dibble duntle on tuesday, and overall, wisconsin and wyoming, you were able to narrow the pledge delegate gap all by just ten delegates total? that's not a pat to the nomination? >> well, that's what happens when you have proportional representation. what is a path to the nomination is we have cut secretary clinton's lead by one third in the last month. we have one eight out of nine
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contests. national polling in the last three polls, two of them have us ahead. we are running stronger against donald trump and other republicans than secretary clinton. we have the momentum. i think we stand a really good chance to do well in new york state and pennsylvania. and as we head into other states. so we are feeling really good with a path toward victory. >> you know, you have said -- you have implied in rallies that you have got win new york if you are going to reset this race. is that fair? >> no. what's fair is to say that new york is enormously important. there are a whole lot of delegates there. i want to do as well as i can. the polling shows that we are narrowing the gap. and obviously a victory in new york state, secretary clinton's state that she represents in the senate, would be an enormous boost for us. >> can you win the nomination without winning new york? >> yeah, absolutely we can. i think we are going to head out west. i think we are looking strong in pennsylvania. we do think, chuck we have got a
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math to victory. because the american people are responding to our message that it's just too laid for establishment politics, establishment economics. we've got to stand up to the about air class. and that is resonating all across this nation. >> as i implied earlier this week there was a bigtive about this issue of you calling secretary clinton unequalified. you walked it back, said she is qualified, but i want to play you something that senator mccasse kell said. >> calling hillary clinton unequalified is like fingernails on the blackboard to females across the country. >> both secretary clinton and senator mccasse kell implied that had hillary clinton been a man you never would have said that. >> senator mccasse kell has been a strong advocate for secretary clinton from day one. and this business about attacking in that regard is absurd. what the truth is is that
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secretary clinton has been going after us along with her surrogates very, very hard. there was, as you know a headline in the washington post, clinton campaign arguing that sanders is unequalified. the point that i was making, which is absolutely correct, is that if you look at where she is getting her money, from wall street and other powerful special interests, she voted for the war, she cited henry kissinger in a sense as a model for her. i think those issues will tell the american people that in many respects she may have the experience to be president of the united states. no one can argue that. but in terms of her judgment, something is clearly lacking. >> so you believe she doesn't have the judgment to be president of the united states? >> well, when you vote for virtually every trade agreement
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that that cost workers of this country millions of jobs, when you support and continue to support fracking despite the crisis that we have in terms of clean water, and essentially when you have a super pac that is raising tens of millions of dollars from every special interest out there, including $15 million from wall street, the american people do not believe that that is the kind of president that we need to make the changes in america to protect the working families of this country. >> all right. youette brought up the whole issue with the money and the speeches to wall street. would you be on higher ground if you released tshsz you have released less about your taxes and tax returns than any other candidate running for president other than donald trump. where are your tax returns? and wouldn't that put you on a higher ground in calling for hillary clinton to say release she is peach transcripts? >> we are going to release. i think we talked about it before. actually, you know, my wife works on our taxes. we've been busy.
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we are going to get all of our taxes out. trust me, there is nothing that is going to surprise anybody. >> are you going to -- but are you going to do seven, ten, 15 years worth of tax returns? so far you have done won? >> we will do the best that we can, but yeah we will get our tax returns out. you know, the issue facing this country, chuck, and why your campaign is doing well, is the american people are tired of establishment politics in which the wealthiest people become much richer. and i would hope that we can focus on those important issues. >> i understand. that i will leave it there i know we'll hear from you a lot in the next ten days. senator sanders thanks for coming on the show? >> my pleasure. >> perspective on the other side. i'm joined by the mayor of new york city, bill deblasio who was on stage with hillary clinton at an event in new york city last night. mayor, welcome back to "meet the press"?
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>> thank you chuck. >> let me ask you this, why is bernie sanders resonating so well in new york state? he may not win, but he is competitive in hillary clinton's home state. you are a strategist as well as an elected official. >> hillary clinton is going to win the state. she has a great operation on the ground, a great well spring of good will from years representing new york. the bottom line is we are going to have a debate on thursday where i think the contrast is going to be clear. i have great respect for both candidates but hillary is a person who can get things done, the kinds of things we need in this country. we have to tax the wealthy. we have to raise wages and benefits. we need things like universal pre-k nationwide. hillary clinton knows how to get thing like that done. that's what the voters are looking for, they are looking for change in this country, but it has to be practical, has to be real. i feel good about your prospects on april 19th. >> you say that the country needs change. what change does hillary clinton
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provide from barack obama? >> the bottom line is look at her whole career? i mentioned pre-k. here's one someone who went to work for the children's defense fubds fund right out of law school has focused on needs for children and families for decades and understands we have to do something very, very different. i have no doubt that hillary clinton in the white house is the natural route to have a nationally run pre-k in this country. in 1993, 1994, there was a vicious attack on her over health care in this country. that resonates about how she will reign in wall street. her plan to reign in wall street is the one that is the most relevant and i think in many ways the toughest. when you look at a history of fighting, knowing how to stands up to powerful interests and having tremendous persistence, those are the characteristics of swhun who can achieve change, actual tangible change that
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people in this country need. one thing we can say it is a year when people in this country are focused on income inequality. it is clearly they don't accept the status quo. >> do you believe -- you know, you took a while before you endorsed hillary clinton. do you believe that if bernie sanders wasn't running that hillary clinton would be speaking as much about income inequality the way she is now? >> i think hillary has long history that piece is speaks to these same issues, children's defense funds, taking on the health insurance companies. >> has bernie sanders moved her asn a way that makes you happy as a progressive. >> i think bernie sanders contributes to this national discussion. i think he deserves a lot of respect for raising important issues. but look at hillary clinton's platform from day one. first major speech she gave was on addressing and ending mass incarceration. she went speech by speech, plank by plank on her platform -- with
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a platform that is the most progressive of any president walking in the white house in a generation. that's that's very consistent with what she has devoted her life to. i think bernie sanders has done something good in this national debate. i think hillary clinton is the u.n. person who can achieve these changes. >> before i go, there was a lot of news about your campaign for mayor a few years ago. the fbi is probing campaign funding activities as part of an investigation of corruption into the n.y.p.d. apparently there is sew some investigation involving your campaign. do you feel confident your campaign polled the law here? >> absolutely do. we are scruulous about that. everything we've done is appropriately and carefully done with many many lawyers, i assure you. but i haven't heard anything about any investigation. there hasn't been any question posed to me or my team. and we don't have any evidence -- >> one other part of this. was any money from our
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non-profit, campaign for one new york used in your campaign? >> no. no. totally separate things. campaign for one, was like affordable housing, appreciation-k for all, that was a separate entity. >> you believe you are going to be cleared in all of that? >> yes, and we have no information about an investigation on our end to begin with. >> mayor deblasio, thank you for coming on. >> thank you, chuck. when we return, can the party take the nomination away from donald trump and ted cruz? if they did, where would the conservative base go. and later, for years, presidents have been racing at the washington nationals game. guess what, there is a new president in town this year who will be racing.t be? safety doesn't come in a box. it's not a banner that goes on a wall. it's not something you do now and then.
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today's data download, we're going to look at the republican delegate fight now that ted kru has won a majority of the delegates in wisconsin and colorado this week. where does that leave donald trump in his path to the nomination? well, that's what we're going to try to show you here. first, here's the most updated delegate count. as you know the magic number is 1237. so we're going to show you how donald trump can get there. he needs 61% of the remaining 798 delegates to do it.
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so how does he get there? well, here's the everything goes right trump scenario in the states that are left to participate in this process. the green states are where we expect trump to do very well. purple means he's likely to win some delegates. and red states are where we believe he will get shut out. so beginning with the green states let's for now go ahead and give all 95 there to new york to delegates to trump. assume a sweep of new jersey as well. 51 more. pretty good start. maryland in this scenario turns out to be trump country. wins almost all the delegates there. that's a big deal. next, indiana, the assumption is momentum takes over. no one's sure what will happen there but if momentum goes right maybe trump does well, gets 39 delegates there. wins majority out of washington state too. again, momentum being a factor and on the last day of voting the assumption is trump actually sweeps all 27 in winner take all states like montana and then wins a majority out in california. meanwhile, trump holds his own in the purple states winning his
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share of delegates in places like rhode island, new mexico and oregon. add it all up and trump walks into cleveland with 1245. it's eight more than he needs. donald trump is a republican nominee. but again, that was a very optimistic, rosy of rosiest scenarios. but here's what we think is a more realistic map. trump still does well in places like new york and new jersey, but he does well in maryland but not quite as well. a little less. maryland looks more like northern virginia where he struggled. so we're going to give him 20 delegates, not 32. indiana votes like nearby wisconsin, expect cruz to win and maybe trump gets only 12 delegates. montana then goes from green to red, becomes a winner take all state for cruz. then washington state happens. again, we expect then this scenario cruz to win but trump to get some delegates. and then california becomes a good state for trump but not a great one. so add it all up and trump winds up short on this scenario 1165,
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72 short of the magic number that he needs. and you know what, if trump is short 72 you can be sure he's not going to win on that first ballot. and then we're looking at multiple ballots with ted cruz or maybe someone else. could it be paul ryan parachuting in and taking this nomination? in fact, how would conservatives feel if the convention took it away from both trump and cruz? would the right just totally walk? my next guest will have an opinion on that. he's the founder of "the blaze," none other than glenn beck. stay with us. if you miss "meet the press," catch highlights in under two minutes on compressed at ok team, what if 30,000 people download the new app? we're good. okay... what if a million people download the new app? we're good. five million? good. we scale on demand. hybrid infrastructure, boom. ok. what if 30 million people download the app?
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or dental procedures. eliquis treats dvt & pe blood clots. plus had less major bleeding. both made switching to eliquis right for me. ask your doctor if it's right for you. welcome back. conservative talk radio has been on fire over the possibility of an open convention that doesn't just deny the republican nomination to donald trump but to ted cruz as well. so just how would the conservative base react to that outcome? glenn beck joins me now. he's the founder of, it's a conservative website and tv network and also endorsed ted cruz by the way. mr. beck, welcome to "meet the press." >> how are you? >> i'm good. >> thank you very much. >> let me start with this concern. we've heard it from many people that are cruz supporters and that are trump supporters over the air waves who are concerned that somehow the party establishment may deny both of them. what would happen, do you think,
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to -- what would your listeners, how would they react? >> i think it would be the end of the gop. i don't think it's going to happen. just said that ted cruz has a 61% chance of winning california. ted cruz has won the last ten in a row with utah and north dakota and wisconsin and colorado. i mean, i just don't see it happening. >> so you think if paul ryan is somehow plucked as the republican nominee, that it would be very bad. >> i do. i think it would be very bad. you can't disenfranchise people. we've all gone out, we've been passionate about it. we've all been going back and forth and voted on the people that we believe. i mean, i really think it has to be one of the two front-runners. but i think people would feel very betrayed. quite honestly, that's why people like bernie sanders and donald trump are doing well is
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because people feel very, very disenfranchised. and they're angry. that's something we don't want to add fuel to. you know, when roger stone was calling and saying he was going to put out the hotel room numbers and encourage people to go to the delegates' hotel rooms and called for the days of rage, which we all remember 1968. that's really not a good thing. we don't want to play into the anger and the hatred and vitreal. we're in this together. martin luther king said we are either going to live like brothers together or we're going to perish together like fools. >> do you think paul ryan is running -- i want to play a quick clip for our viewers of a video he put out on friday. take a listen. >> what really bothers me the most in politics these days is this notion of identity politics. that we're going to win an election by dividing people rather than inspiring people on our common humanity and our common ideals and our common culture and the things that should unify us. we want people to reach their potential in their lives.
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now, liberals and conservatives are going to disagree with one another on that. no problem. that's what this is all about. so let's have a battle of ideas -- >> that could have easily been a general election ad for the republican nominee. >> yeah. >> that came from do you think he's running an underground campaign here? >> i would like to take him at his word, but i don't take really anybody in washington at their word anymore. i don't know what that ad is about, but again, if the gop doesn't find its principles -- this isn't about a candidate coming up with some utopian future for us, this is really about finding our principles. if they don't find our principles, the gop is going to be over. and disenfranchising people who have worked hard and gone out and campaigned for some of these people i think would be a really bad mistake. >> you were pretty aggressively on the never-trump bandwagon. but under this circumstance it sounds like you would prefer a trump nomination if it's not
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cruz over anybody else? >> no, no. i think a trump nomination -- i am a never-trump guy. >> okay. >> i think a trump nomination would be disastrous. with that being said, you can't disenfranchise people. if trump wins the 1237 or wins the first, second, third ballot, it must go to him. and it can't go to dirty politics. you can't continue to disenfranchise people. i will never vote for donald trump, but if he's the guy that is picked with fair play, that's fine. but you have reince priebus saying it will be somebody who is running right now. okay. let's take the gop chair at his word. it's got to be somebody who's running. >> does that mean you'll support a third party bid? and will you actively try to get others to support a third party bid if trump's the nominee? >> i just don't think this is going to happen. i haven't decided on what i would do. i know i will not vote for
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trump. and i would probably go and just look for the strongest people in the house and the senate that would keep hillary clinton at bay. because trump is not going to win the general. if you look at the polls, todd, you know this, no matter what they say, you look at the polls hillary clinton wins every time with donald trump. >> glenn beck, i'm going to leave it there. from appreciate it. good to talk to you. >> thank you. >> thanks for coming on. when we come back, our friends at "snl" had some fun with hillary clinton's efforts to prove she's a genuine new yorker. >> in fact, my head is getting a little chilly. i better put on my favorite hat that i've worn so many times
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and we are back. panel is here. let's get into the democrats a little bit. bill clinton had a run-in with some protesters and it involved him still trying to live down the crime bill of the '90s. let me play both his back and forth with the protesters and then his walkback. take a listen. >> wait a minute, wait a minute, wait a minute. okay. i heard it. can i answer? no, you see, here's the thing. i like protesters, but the ones that won't let you answer are afraid of the truth. you are defending the people who kill killed the lives who say -- i know those people yesterday trying to get good television. and they did. but that doesn't mean i was the most effective in answering it. >> joy, a lot of people assumed that that was a black lives protester confrontation with
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bill clinton. it was not. >> no, it was not. >> as you were telling me and explaining to us earlier. but, boy, that still looked like did bill clinton miss the memo? >> yeah, very awkward. >> talk about his crime bill that everybody is now repudiating. >> yeah, very awkward. a group called philly coalition for real justice, it was a pair of people who said themselves they are not part of black lives matter. that said, the problem with bill clinton's oration and the way he defended himself was that he was defending himself. and that bill clinton, i think, is living emotionally through the repudiation of much of his legacy, whether it's on lgbt rights on or this crime bill or on criminal justice, his legacy's being relitigated in the negative. and i think it's hard for thim to deal with it. what he didn't understand in the role of surrogate it is not your job to defend yourself. and this complicated bill -- >> and he took the bait of the protesters. >> yeah. >> i think he understands it. but since he's left the white house he's been in an incredibly difficult position of not being able to defend his legacy. i had the personal experience in 2008 to do an interview with him
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about his legacy and the clinton campaign squashed it. i've whereritten this before, h talked about it, he's right. the crime bill is much more complicated. >> we don't get correct in the media? >> the victims that bill was addre addressing, the people alive today who might well have been dead given the trajectory of the crime and i was covering were black and poor, he has every right to feel his legacy is being distorted. >> the people asking -- we forget many, many hands were on that, more than half the congressional black caucus voted for it. but people protested it, reverend al sharpton protested to the end because it contained things that we look back on as bad policy. bernie sanders voted for it. >> i found those invigorating it was a sure sign of disaster in the context of the primary politics. but he's right. the bill came in the context of a three-decade crime wave that
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was devastating to american cities. and even if you think we've gone too far in incarceration, i think there's a very good case we have. the increase is primarily driven by violent offenders and people who have committed serious property crimes. so this was not a policy that was born of racism or pointless matter. >> the crime bill did not crack down on non-violent offenders. >> by the way, i want to bring up something else, molly. bill clinton said in his semi-apology, well, i know they wanted to get on television. and it came across as slightly condescending. i want to play something hillary clinton said to me last week about sanders supporters. take a listen. >> i feel sorry sometimes for the young people who, you know, believe this. they don't do their own research. and i'm glad that we now can point to reliable independent analysis to say, no, it's just not true. >> this was on another issue where the fact checkers were on hillary clinton's side, not on bernie sanders side. but it was the way she did that and the waybill clinton did it.
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they seem almost resentful that young voters are not with them. >> i think what you saw bill clinton doing there was an extension of hillary clinton's mood. that she feels like she's bent over backwards to accommodate every demand of the bernie sanders people, the id logical members, the left wing of the party, the activists, every time they've confronted her she's said, you're right, i believe what you believe, yes, yes, and finally she's snapping back and he's snapping back and we're going to say, no, we're going to defend ourselves. we think you're wrong about these things. i think you're lying about my donations from the fossil fuel industry as she said to that protester the other day. so you see the clintons getting a little bit testy. and i think that's what bill regretted. he didn't regret what he said. he didn't regret his message. >> it's not that young people are tilting bernie's way. they're voting at north korean levels for bernie sanders. >> well, on that note let's take a quick pause. we're going to go to our end game segment. back in 45 seconds. what happens when political pandering in new york gets completely out of control?
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we'll show you. - even parents need a time out sometimes, especially from communications technology. so why not spend one hour totally unplugged? read, talk, make art, or whatever. no batteries required. the new york city subway is the best way to get around. it's been a while.
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is this a working metrocard? is this -- i'll just go in the old-fashioned way. i'll take a cab. cab is the best way to get around. >> end game time and that was snl's take on the pandering by hillary clinton ahead of the new york primary, but let's give hillary clinton a break here. she's not the only one being accused of new york city pandering, and frankly, snl didn't exactly need to create the parody, the candidates themselves have been. take a look. >> i really -- i love it because it's so convenient. it is just the best way to get around. >> thank you, and i would simply say to everyone, la chaiam. >> breads upside down. that's bad luck. >> now, show us how it's done, please. >> i can feel it.
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>> are you all ready? >> by the way, it was "the view" folks that pushed sanders to show how to eat a new york pizza. but oh, my gosh. >> last night on "saturday night live" nobody likes to ride the subway. let's not pretend. >> i have trouble too with the little swipe card. what is she doing on the subway? where's she going? >> i think she was trying to mock bernie sanders for using -- for talking about tokens, which they haven't used tokens in a while. >> doesn't she have anything better to do? >> it's about time we have some new york pandering. it's always iowa pandering. >> politicians pander because it works obviously. they do it over and over again. i also think new yorkers are so self-centered that there is no possible way to pander to them too much. there's no new yorker that goes, oh, you like us too much. it's over the top. >> i absolutely agree 100%. new yorkers absolutely believe
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there is no pander too hot. let me go back to the republican side. rich, your take on glenn beck and what he said about paul ryan. >> i think it's right. it would be a very bad idea. if there's one thing we've learned about this process, republican voters, they're not interested in someone who's embedded in the party's leadership, they're not interested in someone who's donor friendly and soft on immigration. it would be one thing if ryan was a compromise between cruz and trump. he's a rejection of both of them in 70% of republican voters. so a lot of this chatter is just the establishment still cannot get its mind around the fact that the choice before it is trump or cruz. >> again, kasich is not a choice anymore? >> i'm still baffled by the fact that he's still there. i'm wondering who is giving him money. can we just for a moment go back and pause on glenn beck and this come together, we're all in this together message. this was the guy who launched the 912 movement on the anniversary of the march on washington saying they were the real heirs to king's legacy and saying the president of the united states hates white people and hates the white culture. i find it interesting that he's
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decided to take on this keen role in his own mind to bring the country together. on the political sphere, i think he's right. i think the establishment cannot answer a revolt from its own base by saying we will give you this other establishment guy who's way better than the other establishment folks. >> it was an amazing box that i feel like they basically put the party in. he's basically saying you can't ever nominate trump, i'll never support him. but hey, you better nominate him if it isn't cruz. >> i think his argument contradicts himself. on the one hand he's saying that we have to respect the will of the voters. if the voters feel disenfranchised, it will split the party as if that hasn't already happened. but if we're assuming that it's a brokerered convention, which i think is probable, nobody has a majority of the vote. you will have -- this is not a democratic process. >> i object to the word disenfranchised because i don't know where all these people got the idea that somehow party primaries are constitutionally protected. it's always been this way. >> by the way, i also want to
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remind people, again, we're a republic. these private organizations called the democratic party and republican party, private organizations, not governed by the constitution, chose to essentially mirror the constitution's choices. the constitution says we're going to have an electoral college, a federal system decide who our president is and the two parties agreed. >> and the delegates there -- >> we're doing american government teachers good today. >> it's a relatively recent innovation. this wasn't always the case. it's only in the last few decades they have chosen to resemble more the quasi-democratic -- >> however you pick the delegates, the fact remains it's always been the two -- dwight eisenhower, richard nixon, they didn't show up to the convention with the delegates. they had to go there and twist arms and earn it. just because you're doing it with primaries and caucuses more now -- >> shouldn't you prove that you can do some behind-the-scenes stuff too? >> organizing has always been
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part of politics. 1237 is not an arbitrary number, it's a majority. >> at least for the republicans, their fundamental problem is not listening to the base of their own party. i think it would be the ultimate irony if they attempted to fix that by once again not listening to the base of their party. >> i want to talk about we have a new president already here. i know we're talking about the election of a new president in 2017 but we have a new one. we're focused on this one, this race, but we have a new president in washington. and this -- in fact the new president is in town or back in town starting today. he's a new old president. herbert hoover, the nation's 31st president, will debut as the newest edition to the washington nationals racing president mascot that compete on the field in the middle of the fourth inning. i got an exclusive interview with herbie earlier this week. take a look. >> are you going to be somebody that can actually win these races? yes or no. yes, you will win these races. and when you lose, do you end up
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going into a great depression? is that wrong? is that wrong? is it too soon? >> anyway, by the way, herbert hoover actually that's his third appearance on "meet the press," guys, because he was actually on twice as a former president. this all, by the way, is a white house historical association has an new ornament honoring the 1929 west wing fire that took place while hoover was president. the ornament that they're going to be selling and giving away to fans that get questions about herbert hoover right at national games is a wonderful little fire truck. that ornament is worth all of it, it's really cool. >> i won't be satisfied until all the racers are late 19th or early 20th century republicans. >> you show up dressed like that at yankee stadium, you've got a problem. >> we'll be back next week. if it's sunday, it's "meet the press." s sponsored in
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part by barracuda networks, cloud-connected security and storage solutions that simplify it; city national bank, providing loans and lines of credit to help northern california businesses grow. scott mcgrew: can big data predict big injuries in sports? kitman labs' stephen smith has convinced top-level teams his software can do it. even we didn't know the modern roller coaster started as a silicon valley success story. and a look at "the membership economy." our reporters joe menn of reuters and jon swartz of "usa today," this week on "press:here." [music]


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